Should I Get Started With Probates? Probate Mastermind 325

Show Notes and Download

Join Future Episodes Live in the All The Leads Facebook Mastermind Group:  https://facebook.com/groups/alltheleadsmastermind

Previous episodes: https://alltheleads.com/podcast

Interested in Probate Leads? https://alltheleads.com/probate-leads

Get Certified with the Probate Mastery Course.


Thanks for tuning in, and don’t forget to subscribe for future episodes!



Episode Topics:
00:00 General Updates (The first 6 minutes of this call are not included in the recording due to audio issues.)
00:44 Should I Get Started With Probates?
8:37 Does This Property Have To Go Through Probate?
12:20 Montgomery, AL Market: Growing Investor Interest and Participation
29:01 Pitching Your Probate Services To Attorneys

Be sure to check out our full Mastermind Q&A Playlist

Looking to hear prospecting tips in action? Check out our live role play series

--

Support the show (http://www.facebook.com/groups/alltheleadsmastermind)

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Probate Mastermind Podcast. These episodes are recorded live once a week and are hosted by the AllTheLeads.com coaches. Agents, investors, and wholesalers join the coaches each week for everything from marketing tips, sales, psychology, live deal analysis, transaction engineering, advanced real estate strategy and personal development. You will learn to get more listings, more deals and find financial freedom by listening to these episodes. Be sure to catch show notes at AllTheLeads.com/podcast and join our free Facebook mastermind community:

https: 0:32

//facebook.com/groups/AllTheLeadsMastermind Please note that the first 6 minutes of this call were not recorded. Thank you. Have you been through Bruce's foundations program yet? No, not yet. No, not yet. Yeah. That'd be a great place to say, Hey, what's happening, man? Good. Yeah. We're looking forward to getting you into foundations and as well as those of you that have are also on this call or listening one of the best places to start, obviously this is a. This is equally valuable, is getting getting you in and asking questions and hearing what some of your other peers are doing in the same space. Now, what we had done I guess when we were choppy is we'd asked. Those of you, and I might pose the question to you, sir. What you've done to generate either extra leads or faster conversations in a market like we're in. Cause obviously there's more people going after the same pie and the pie seems to have have whittled down a little bit as well. So we want to hear what you guys are doing to get calm, more conversations or more leads in this market. Rolling actually, that's one of the reasons why I'm on the call because typically I call expireds in over the last three weeks. Both of my services, it's been pretty much zero expires hitting the market. We switched to the, just listed, just sold, but I need another revenue stream. And I've always thought about probate. However, the challenge is the conversation, the sensitivity around the conversation, ah, as far as for me, I would, that would be very challenging. I just lost a pet three weeks ago that had been with me for 13 years. And I am still sensitive to the fact that, I got his ashes yesterday. I started crying, but the sensitivity in in, in how do we do it in a professional manner that still accomplish business, but still respect the loved one that's passed away. Yup. Yup. Very true. The the first thing is to recognize what what people are actually hearing when we call them and when we write them. And and recognizing that occasionally you are going to run into that person who might be overly sensitive to the prospect that your outreach most people are not overly sensitive. And unless they hear you asking something that That they don't want to talk about normally. What they think that we're saying is I, sorry, your mom died. You want to sell the house? And so building a dialogue approach around the fact that we know that they're going to be prone to hearing that out of, or interpreting that out of what we're asking. And creating an approach where they just can't interpret that shark in the water mentality that we might have. So in doing so, not only do we show empathy not only do we offer offer our kind of condolences, but we're really also taking them into the future and we're helping them see. What life is going to be like when this is all done. Once this hard heart of their life is behind them they need to be able to, they need to be able to kind of future pace them. They need to be able to imagine how good life is going to get again after this difficult time and just show them that we're the people, we're the person that can get them there. And it's okay if they're sensitive, it's okay. If they are emotional, that's completely normal and they need to know that it's okay. They need to know it's okay. Jim, Tim, do you guys have anything to add? Important thing to remember also is that in, in many cases, the person who's acting as PR is also not the, a direct lineal descendant of the person. It may be this may be the sharpest person in the family. Wasn't real close to aunt Nell, but there's, real good about business. We'll let him handle it. And oftentimes we become overly sensitive to the fact that the person that we're talking to, may have been a person who just recently suffered a loss and they really didn't feel a loss that dramatically, they didn't, it's not an emotional issue for them. And so you've got to make sure. That who you're talking to and, and find a good way to establish the nature of the relationship between that purple representative and a feeding. So you know where that's just the Vivity is if you find out that it's, a family friend who was appointed to it. Yes. They knew them, but they didn't cry themselves to sleep that night because they lost somebody that was near and dear to their heart. They're actively moving as quickly as they can. To get this done and their pressure point and pain point is the fact that as soon as it's over their struggle is over. Let me tell you, let me chime in with this recently I lost two pets as well, and this might make me a terrible person, but I handled the loss of my pets worse than the loss of my grandparents. Have I've also lost in the past couple of years. So you reference hat and we can't just draw a conclusion that everyone that we talk to is emotionally distraught. If they are, they might be numb and they might have their head down. And they're just getting through this legal process faster than as fast as they can. So you're not going to talk to a ton of people that have just this emotionally raw feeling to them. Yep. And the other thing I would add, and I've said this many times, these are not obituary leads on average. It's three to four months, sometimes a little bit longer from the date of death until the probate gets filed. Four months later, the people may not be completely over the grief that they probably are, but they've, they're at least past it enough that they've made the business decision to go hire an attorney and file the probate. There's a lot of things to factor in, like Bruce said, but don't assume. We all also say there's a big difference between false empathy and empathy. You probably don't want to say, I'm sorry for your loss of a better start is I'm sure this is a difficult time for your family, acknowledge the empathy, but don't. You're not going to, fight by saying, I'm sorry for your loss. It sounds insincere. And again, these are all things that Bruce will go over in the foundations training. So if you haven't taken the foundations, that's a really good place to start. Just email support and all the leads.com and just say, I'm interested in foundations, or if you're a subscriber, you can do it straight from your subscriber portal, under training. If you're not a subscriber email, the support line. That was a really long and complicated answer to your question. No, you guys, did you guys made some valid points? Number one, like the only, so I'm going right now, Bruce did sign up. Perfect. Awesome. All right. Thank you, sir. Anything else we can help you with today? No, that's it. That's that's it. Thank you and thank you for making sure that everybody else can hear us. Like I said, we're at the same room. We appreciate the technology heads up. Thanks for contributing. No, I, I've been on that other end, so I understand. Exactly. All right thank you very much. Take care. Next up, we have three more in the queue. Next step is phone number ending in six three seven zero. You're up next. Are you there? Area code four, three, four. I think it's David. Are you there? I really want to hear from David cause I used to have a four, three, four area code. So David, please chime in. I have a feeling you probably have to unmute us on whatever device you're using. David. Alright, get back in later. Yeah. David, when you figure it out. Please just hit star six and hit one. And we'll put you back in the bottom of the queue. Next up is phone number ending in five, four, one eight. You're up next? I hope. Are you there? Five, four, one eight five four, one eight. Anybody home? All right, one more in the queue, guys. Please jump back in. When you unmute yourself, it starts fixing hit one and you shouldn't come in. You don't unmute yourself when you go into the queue cause you come in, mute it and then I'm unmuting you one at a time. If he's, once you get into queue star six at one, just don't do anything and you should be fine. Next up is phone number ending in seven one three seven. I hope you're there. I am good morning. We have a winner. I think it was like the tech issue in the beginning because I had to sign out and sign back in. However, I have a question, gentlemen, I had a client reach out to me to lift his mom's property. Has power of attorney, no issue. Their mom actually passed away. Two days ago. So now my question is, am I able to still list traditionally or does this have to go into probate because I'm new to the probate world, help us understand the situation. The mom passed away two days ago. Are you saying that mom was the personal representative or was who was the original person that passed away? So mom is the owner of the property. Her children have had power of attorney because she's ill. Unfortunately, she actually passed away before we listed the property traditionally with the power of attorney that they have for mom's property. And now, do we actually have to go into probate or am I able to say the list? Traditionally? What state are you in California? Yes. Yes. This would be probably one I don't, this is not an ideal situation, but I'm going to put a silver lining on it. This is your opportunity to refer a really good attorney, specifically one who will get them as executors full authority and not partial authority to backdrop. So anytime you can catch something like this, when it's really early, and there's not already an attorney involved that might've set it up in an opportune way you should be able to take these folks to a good probate attorney if you have one. And if you don't use the opportunity to call and interview a couple of attorneys and talk to them about the difference between full authority, partial authority and what their preference is. If it was me, I send them through to an attorney that was willing to do full authority. That would give you the ability to sell the property as quickly as possible. Okay. Got it. Taking notes. Who's your mom, did your mother have, did your mom have anything any sort of trusts in place or anything like that? Or, and did she own the house free and clear? The property is paid off. The son says that there is a will there's no trust. And so PRI again, prior to her passing out a power of attorney was enough for us to list the property. She was still alive. However, as we're about to put the listing live, she passed away. So that was the reason for my call today was getting clarity on how we actually move forward so that legally I'm doing my part properly and that they're taken care of as well. Yeah. You may, one thing that we're all we're always careful to do on these calls is not give legal advice you have. If you've got, if you had valid powers from power of attorney standpoint, to make sure that the attorney knows that you had that, and I'm not going to claim intimate familiarity with the exact captain versa law in California. And we have other probably subscribers on this call who are, but you may find that there is. Some men are legal standing in regard to the power of attorney. So I'd asked that question as well. Don't fail to mention to the attorney before you do this, that you did already have power of attorney and, is there any way that utilizing your justing and legal power, you can sell that property or does it have to wait on probate? Got it. All right. Perfect. I appreciate it. All right. Thank you. We only have, hold on. Anything else we can help you with? No, that was it. I appreciate it. Thank you. Alright, pre-teacher participate in. We only have one more in the queue guys. Don't be shy. Hit star six and hit one. We got plenty of time. Next up is Joe layman familiar name? What can we do for you, Joe? How are you doing? Man I'm doing great. I got two things for you. One is just handled in a state in a very I think kinda different way that might be helpful for other people. Sure. This wasn't a property in an area of town that has previously declined, hit bottom and is slowly. Kind of coming back. I like the Phoenix from the ashes and the property is sale was built in 1925. Had not been maintained. A relative of the owner had been living there after the owner passed away and was a hoarder and just all foreign and it needed a turn of work. And was one of the worst trash out she ever seen. Just filthy gross. I, it was difficult for me to even walk through the property and what I did was rather than list it and put it into the multiple listing service put it online with our gum Bree real estate investment group open for viewing on a certain date. It's due by a certain date with very specific bid terms and a bid form, all cash as is where is no one faction seller to noodle, no repairs whatsoever. And and had a successful process in about 10 days. It's now under contract close Wednesday, the fifth, under those terms, the seller was very happy with what we were able to get, which wasn't much $13,100 value is probably about 80,000, maybe, but it's got 50, $60,000 worth of work. It's got a penny. And the seller is paying$2,000 and the buyer is paying me $2,000. I love it. So it was a way to really get rid of a dog property that would probably just sit out there on the MLS and not get much action for a long period of time, because you would be playing a real guessing game as to where to price it. I think we call that story how to get a 40% commission. Yeah. I think you could package and sell that. Joe. That's a basic good for you. But you brought up Joe that you put it out into your investors group. Was that a with better Rhea or was that just another area investors, groups that you're in. No, it's a Montgomery is the Montgomery area, real estate investment club, but they really are not strongly affiliated with Raya, but it's a similar type group we got, Oh, I think there's about six to 700 people on the Facebook site now. And we have about 80 a hundred folks showing up at a monthly meeting. It's really, we've really grown it over the last year and a half since I came back to Montgomery. I'll tell ya a lot of times for those of you that are agents that are out there you need to be using Joe's technique and taking some of these properties that maybe need some worms. And obviously if you're a part, if you're a realtor and you're part of an association of realtors and an MLS. You might have some disclosures assigned, but if you don't have an MLS or maybe something that, that needs needs a lot of work on the property, use that because these RIAs and these investor associations and investors clubs can really go a long ways. And a lot of times they can get just as much traction as the MLS would. Often we think that the MLS is the end all be all. And if you are not a licensed agent and and you. Maybe don't have an interest in buying a particular property yourself, plug into your investor groups that are local, because there are a lot of buyers and a lot of cash buyers there. And I am Joe, I'm sure you get this question a lot as a coach and as a coach, I get this question a lot is where do I find my list of cash buyers? You've got 80 people right there and that investors group that is you, probably your list of cash buyers. I absolutely. Two things additionally, about this, the lady that is the heir of the estate, the executor of the estate has terminal cancer and is in very bad condition. So this was a blessing to her to just get rid of it and get it off her plate and get it out of the way because it was bothering her. And then the second thing is that the. Buyer actually live in this part of town is called castle height and has been buying renovating properties and being sure that they go to an owner occupant as part of a group there. That's trying to revive the neighborhoods. So this was a blessing in many ways. Yeah. Great job, Joe D Joe, I'm assuming you're is proactive as you, are you already belonged to the local real estate group or did you go out and locate them for this particular deal? Huh? Oh, no. I've belonged to him for the last couple of years. When I first got back to town and I located them and I started going to their meetings that they were having, like this thing, 20 people show up. Yeah. Now we've got it up to the last meeting we had over a hundred people. Nice. And it's really getting, it's really getting active. People are being more willing to share information, more thing more and more. Stuff's getting posted on the, into the Facebook group, et cetera. So it's it's making, Hey Joel, I ask a question at the beginning of the call and I don't know if it is, I think it's the technology problem might not have come through, but Given as strong as the sellers market is now, what do you see yourself and people in your group? What are they doing differently to get deals anything different or is it just, you got to make a lot more contacts to find a good one? Our probate leads is one thing, but for people that are out there that are trying to host sale or do flips or use the Burr method to invest. Th they're having to do a lot of cold call prospecting and a lot of mailings. And there, and some of them are spending a lot of money on that effort. Yeah. Yeah, you make a great point that this probably it is probably more valuable now than it's ever been for that reason. How many markets have any expireds anymore? It's the only reason anything's expiring is just grossly overpriced. And how many, what's that snow coach with, I'm still coaching with Mike ferry and I can tell you a ton of markets and the expired listings and fisbos are nominal. Yeah. And the Fez bios hit the market and sell themselves. Boom. And they usually sell themselves because some real estate agent is paying attention and has a buyer for that area. That price range and fisbos are getting multiple offers. Sure. So your only options are to go home cold just wants to just sold or go cold Gordon Dornoch, or you can operate in a much warmer, much hotter pool of people that are, people that are not getting prospected and need to sell. And a significant number of them are absentee owners. Is that true in your market? Most of them will have it in the area. Most of the airs with. With my probate leads. I find I do better with the absentee personal reps than anything. Yeah, exactly. You got zero competition. You're probably the only one reaching out to him. Just, that's just about truth. Now help me understand something. We've got a couple of different things going on. You've got the training. Being done with ATL and then Chad Corbett is doing his thing, having gone through probate mastery before Sam went out and did the separate thing I'm into, but there's chance you haven't heard of the relationship with all the leaves. I don't understand all this help cup here. Help me understand how all this is working right now with Bruce and Chad and you guys, we had a major falling out. No, we did not. We did not. We shot Chad. I'm sorry to let you know that Chad's no longer alive yet. No. So mastery is still an incredible course. We promote it. We think that we think that you guys should be taking mastery What foundations was born out of is probably really important. And it was born out of Y I, Bruce was hired by all the leads and that was to coach people up on the things that they should be accountable to. And over. Over time that really only came down to three things that I was coaching on weekend and week out. And instead of taking eight months per person to coach them on those three things, I decided to go ahead and start putting it out there. And in a class. And so you're going to get some of that class some of those topics and mastery as well with a different spin on it. Cause I think most of you that heard Chad and I on calls know that we have slightly different styles. So just because I teach someone how to do marketing or dialogue building, it doesn't mean that it's the way that they need to do it. So we encourage you to get Chad's version as well. And then and then otherwise you're going to go a lot deeper with mastery. So you're going to pay for it. It's still an incredibly affordable and in my opinion, undervalued class, I think that it's something that you should pro that, that most of our subscribers definitely should take. But if you want those foundational elements that I would be coaching on and it would take me months and months to coach you on it then come to foundations and get it in two days. And Joel, I would also point out we used to do the monthly role-play call the first Wednesday of every month, where we would take people start to finish through a role-play. And there was just such a variety of different ways that things could be handled. Bruce's even taken the role-play call in broken into segments. And Bruce, maybe share a little bit of that rather than run through a complete role-play. He does in the, in part of the foundations training, he has, you go he'll practice the opening dialogue, right? And then you go into a breakout room. What are some of the other things that you, so that you break down I'll share. So we break out your introduction. So you're gonna, you're going to get the four main elements of how you should introduce your service to someone that just answered the phone you've never spoken with before. And then we practice it for about 15 minutes and then we go in and we break down what your elevator pitch or your some of, it is a USP needs to sound like, and then we go into breakout rooms and practice it. And then we start hitting objections. We talk about how to handle objections, and then we go practice it and laugh. We we take the time to deal with appointment closes. So what are the techniques for turning that conversation into an appointment at the house? And so we take what used to be a monthly role-play call. And now we're doing four role-play calls, practicing the individual components of the call on the same section, Joe. You've been, I know I'm sharing this as a benefit to everybody else. You've been to the class. And it's very different. Yep. But at any rate we do encourage people to take mastery. This is not a replacement. This is just something that's meant to get you get a new subscriber up and running faster so that they don't have to go through months of private coaching and waiting on their next month call. They can just jump into one of the classes that are taught a couple of times each month and get it down. And then as they perfect that they can move on into mastery. Okay. Yeah, it doesn't mean, I wouldn't say, you know, I appreciate you bringing it up and it gives us an opportunity to talk about, it's the where's Waldo conversation. I think we should be doing a travel log of what Chad's up to, but yeah, Chad is still certainly a part of all of our lives and, we love Chad. He's part of our, our we're all still very close friends. And as a matter of fact, Chad, we're all in Florida this weekend, Chad just happens to be down here and. We'll probably all get together. We've all seen him. He and I talk pretty frequently. And we're definitely still working together. Chad still works with us. Does marketing work for us? And a bunch of other stuff. Chad, just getting the opportunity to live out his dream life, which is to not be tied down to doing things like this every week. We're just, We're just punks. We sit here and do it all the time. Cause we love it. And Chad wanted to go out and really pursue his best life. Uh, Just the opportunity to go do that. And we're happy for him to do that, but don't ever think that uh, there were many uh, intimacy and him doing what he's doing, or us doing something else. We're all still there closest to friends and uh, expect to be that way for forever and ever. And uh, he has got a lot of valuable input and part of our agreement that we made when we decided to make some of the changes that we made was that. We, we nailed down first a cooperative agreement where we would all work together to create uh, you know, an opportunity to have mastery, continue to be a part of what we're doing. And we know we need to create some other pieces, but we're definitely all still playing the same game and playing it together. So we're in good shape with that. Just letting you know, you didn't ask that question, but sometimes it's important to hear that. Chad's not gone and not forgotten by any stretch of the imagination. So I just thought I would, I'm glad I gave you the opportunity to put that information out to the pumps on looking at it. Thank you. I appreciate it. Always good to hear from you. You always have an interesting perspective on things and you're an innovative guy and I love innovation. It's always good to hear what's coming from your part of the world as well, because. You tend to be a pretty good barometer about what's going on in the marketplace as well. So we appreciate that from you and Joe. Great idea with the re I started to say for those of you that don't know how to find an investor group, you can simply just Google investor group in my County. Another pretty surefire way is rhea.com, R E I a.com. It's a national organization of chartered real estate, industrial associations. And you can. Quick there a map will come up and if you're in any large city, there's probably a local group. Go join it, go to the meetings. It's not only a good way to learn. You'll put Joan, you're probably the teacher in the group, but it's a great way to network. And your example is a great or your story was a great example of that. We appreciate you. Anything else we can help you with this week, Joe? No, I'm good. Thank you guys. All right, buddy. I think you're great, man. Thank you. Next up is phone number. I think it was one of the people that was locked out before phone number ending in one, three, three, one. Are you there now? Hey, small world, actually, coach Lehman is he used to be my coach actually. Awesome. Once you hear that voice, you remember that voice from, Holy cow, right? You think he has a distinctive voice? I don't know what you're talking about. Yeah. Very. Very awesome guy. Very Joe, how you doing this is Antwan. Yeah, I wanted some as Kosho had talked about the clarification, I did go on the website and it was a little concerned losing as far as that, but try to clarify the different programs. I guess my next step would be I sign up and then I get Mr. Hills coaching. Program and platform. If I want to sign up for the whole deal, the market, I guess the mailbox motivator and the whole package. Who do I do that with? Are you a subscriber at this point? No, not yet. No. We'll call you. We'll have Darcy or Georgia reach out to you after the call and kind of walk you through the whole program, but. Long story short. If you're getting leads from us, this is all included and free. If you're not, the foundation's program has a very nominal charge. It's well worth it, but it's a good time to have a conversation with one of our, with Jordan or Darcy or Natalie about, what's included in, in the entire program, leads, mailbox, motivators the whole system, but we'll have one of them reach out to you right after the call. Super. Thank you. All right. Is there anything, was there anything, any other questions that you had on either the program or the process? No. No not at this time. I'm just, I awesome guys. Thank you for participating. We appreciate it. We've got, we got one more in the queue guys. Somebody else jump in there with somebody out there has got to have a win of the week. Or just an innovative, brilliant idea on, how they're getting more leads, but before I activate your Bruce ones and say, Oh, and I'm just going to, Hey, I'm looking those of you that are working to get more leads, I'm looking for a specific answer here. And if nobody gives it, you're going to make me give it at the end of this call. Cause I do have something that most of you all should be doing, but I'm hoping someone else can come up with it. So that I don't dominate every call that we have. If somebody comes up with it, we'll give you some historical leads in your market for free. All right. An extra prize this week. All. Alright great. So it's I guess what Bruce was talking about a time somebody come out and share that please hit star six and then it was, I'll be amazed if anybody gets it, but people are excited. So you never know. All right, next up is phone number ending in one, three, seven, four. You're up next? Okay. Great. This is Duane Smith and Oregon. So I've talked with a couple of lawyers in my area and they all want me to get the designation. So I was thinking about doing the probate mastery certification course. But they want it to be Oregon specific. Any ideas, how I can nail it down because they want me to have the legal ease for my state. The idea how to do that, or what is it they're asking you to get. The probate certification. But they want it to be Oregon specific. Yeah. Yeah. That's I think they're asking you for something that is probably a CE course of some sort and probate mastery is very specific to what we do and how we do it. It is a, it is more a a marketing program and all of that. I think they're looking for you. If you're asking what I think they're asking you for, there's some sort of continuing ed continuing education thing that they could then say, I'm giving it to someone that has been certified by someone other than us, that's recognized by, the state or something like that. Yeah, probably mastery is not a, we're actually moving to have get CE credit. That's one of the things that's getting done, but it's not going to be something first off that's Oregon specific and there's no authorizations for it to do that. I think what I would recommend is that you go back to them, if you can, and say, look, here's what probably a master's is. And here's what I, here's what I learned in this. Here's what the curriculum is. And my focus in probate mastery and taking that training. Mr. Ramirez attorney, this will make your job easier to get you to the point of closure on probate faster. That's all I'm trying to accomplish with this. And that's why I'm valuable to use. Here are all the things that I do, but if they're looking for some certification, that's a, that's more in this case, far more of a legal orientation then a marketing and an expedition. Behavior representation, I think. Yeah, just to add to that, you could certainly go to your Oregon association of realtors and see if they order it. I doubt that I'm going to say offer it. I doubt they do very much. You could also go back to the attorney and. You don't make it a quid pro quo, you know that, Hey I'm committed to learning as much as I can about probate, like Tim said, and making your job easier. And every month I'm getting leads and don't have an attorney. If I refer some of those people back to you, would you be willing to spend a few hours and just teach me about anything that's unique to Oregon? The attorney does a fair trade and you're going to send him there, but then we actually find other than A friend of mine calls it the people's Republic of California, which is not as it is for you, California, but there's more laws, rules, and regulations. Other than California, there is a very much different from state to state. It's a pretty for pretty uniform code of practices. There's some smart, some States have different smallest state exemptions. I know Texas has monument of title. I had never heard of anything unique or different about Oregon. So not that there isn't, but I would think your attorney could probably teach you what's different about Oregon in a very short code is done. Is this one attorney or several attorneys have asked you this? It's been a couple, two or three. Speak more to why they're asking you. And cause I've never had an attorney ask me that and. Many dozens of conversations. So do you do you have an idea of what your, how your conversations are going that might be leading to them asking you for this certification? Basically they just want me to know what I'm talking about because I am a subscriber to our leads and I am getting the the leads and Calling them, some of them and asking specifically if how I can be part of their referral team it, and so they want to make sure that I actually have the education that I need. Okay. So that therein lies the challenge. So I always assume that I'm going to be a part of their referral team. I don't ask how. I assume my my inclusion and that referral team. And typically what I do is either on the phone, a zoom or face to face is just say to them, look I'm not meeting with you so that I can get one way referrals from you to my business. I'm meeting with you so that I can find out how I can better provide value, because I want this to be a two-way street where not only. You helped me with some referrals, but I help make your life easier and refer you with the question that you're asking them. I think it's leaving the door open for them to say, go get a certification that may or may not exist in Oregon. It, it might not exist. I don't know. But you're leaving the door open the way that you're asking it and said, just to assume inclusion and tell them that you want to provide services to their clients that makes their client's lives easier and their jobs easier. And then say, what kind of services can I offer you that would do that? Would it help if I coordinated clean outs for your clients? Would it help if I courier documents that you needed to be signed? What types of services can I offer that you would find beneficial? And then they're never even going to ask you to go get it, take a class. And then if you do want to take the class take mastery. Yeah. I've done foundations place Oh, good. I'll be doing it again. So with the mastery, does it. It says it's a certification. So will there be something that I can put on marketing materials and things like that shows that I get through it. You definitely get a certificate when it's done. We certify you at that point as having passed through the curriculum and all of that, you will have gone through, 10, 15 hours worth of training and you'll know everything that you could possibly know. And. A lot of stuff, you probably never thought you'd need to know and you'll get it all in that period. Of course they do come out of it with certification. But I think probably the thing that I would take away with this is that I think if you talk to a few more attorneys and you talk to them positively about all the things you're looking to offer, certain cases are not going to come up in that conversation at all. They're going to be, if they're going to do business with you, they're going to do it because you bring them value. And if you're not clearly delineating the value that you bring. I would look at this sort of case in question more of the wind and put you off then some sort of a qualifier. And I think that maybe an, a more strong way to put what Bruce was saying nicely. I think they're probably blowing me off by telling me you got to say certification. That's my guess. Okay. I do start with the, I want to be able to refer them to my clients and they are. Interested in that, but then they, because I am newer to the program they asked me what, how far I am and the probate learning probate. And I explained everything that I've learned so far. And then that's when they say that I needed the certification. So what it is, and it could be a blow off, but honestly, I'm a big believer in wordsmithing, a kind of right. Yeah. And something about the way that you're asking is giving them a really open path to requiring you to have a certification. So we just want to figure that out and it sounds to me like, it's the question? What do I need to do to work myself into being one of the agents you refer asking that question? Sounds good. But it's leading them to give you the certification answer and nobody ever asks me for it because I don't ask, what do I need to do? I just assume their referral. And it doesn't mean that they all give it to me, but but it's just the slightly different way of approaching that business when you can also take it to even a higher level and you can basically pitch your processes. I'm out literally. Looking for I'm shopping for attorney to potentially blessed with what I have. In other words, you get them into the fear of missing out. It's not so much that you're looking to offer them all this sort of stuff. If you're really trying to find the right attorney to refer people to that will act expeditiously and get things done and health, and want to figure out if they're the right attorney to work with now, the fuse on the other foot. Make them qualify to do what you want to go. And that's the ultimate in getting that done. And I think that's part of what Bruce was saying. He never gets asked the question because by the time, Bruce has gone through what he's doing, what he's talking about, and they're anxious to do that. Now. They really want to make sure that you see them as the right attorney to work with. So it's just a growth process. If you do this a few more times than you become comfortable, With what you're saying, you're gonna, you're gonna figure this out very quickly and you'll know exactly what to say when to say it. And you're not going to get asked that question. I don't believe there's any requirement in Oregon for them to do that. And we've been dealing with folks in your state since we started the program. It's the first time any of which has ever heard that. That means that it exists. I'm just saying that's new to us for her. Okay. Yeah. As far as the continuing education I've searched my local association, the state association, and I even went to the real estate agency and there's nothing in the continuing education on probate in the state I didn't expect that there would be. Yeah. And I think a lot of the time, you put yourself in their position it's a circumstance where. They've got a limited amount of time and they just want to, part of that is they want to make sure that they're not investing energy time, money, or anything else in somebody who's not gonna deliver value on their end. So the more, and the stronger you'd come off in their eyes, the better off you're going to be in terms of getting them to be anxious, to work with you because they see value in it. They see more money and more opportunity and more time back in their pocket to get stuff done. You can get more billable hours out of the program. I don't want to sound like we're beating up on you that you're doing everything wrong. First of all, you're doing a lot, you're doing a lot. Just making the calls and getting the points and getting the appointments. I would say that maybe you, it sounds to me like you're not completely confident cause you feel like you should know everything. And maybe just, if you do get it, if you come in more competent that you don't know everything, but you've got a group of 12,000 people and you've got all of us to get the answers, it might make you feel a little more confident and even an answer like that is. I don't know at all, but I'm a part of the biggest group of drill probate professionals in the country. And if you, or one of your clients wants, wants an answer that I can't provide I'll get it quickly and I'll get back to them. So maybe that'll give you that extra competence to come across more competent and you'll get that objection, less, some brewers for that. I was just gonna kinda soften the the fact that we were beating up on you a little bit as well. And I think it's important to know here I am sitting here on this stage with all the leads. 17 plus years into the real estate business. And I think that you need to know is someone that we just critiqued that in my first full year, in real estate, I only sold one house. So I made $1,800 and that was full-time. And when I'm telling you to wordsmith things and critiquing what you're saying and your business it's because I've had to do it in my business. And the fact that you are getting the same answer now is what's going to make you really good in the future. And there are some people that things just come naturally to. And normally that person stays a little bit better than mediocre, but they stay better than mediocre for their entire career. Whereas someone that goes through the struggles and the challenges of maybe only selling one house in a year or or having attorneys tell them to go get a designation you're going to improve. And it's going to make you far better than the, than those, that, that conversation just came easy to right out of the gate. I believe that. Alrighty. Yeah, I the last one just yesterday is the longest conversation I've been able to have with a lawyer and it was about 45 minutes. So that is great. And yeah. Yeah. He dumped a lot of information on me of what he wants to see and then, which is only going to take, a month, maybe two, and then he's happy to refer me. So yeah, Go ahead. I'm sorry. W so that is, at the positive of a rejection, I guess rejection phone call is the fact that he kept me on the phone for 45 minutes dumping information. We can compliment you. We always say, reach out to the executives first, but remember the executors are probably one, two deals at the most. We always tell people, work, the attorneys can be a career worth of referrals, and I am. I, if I had to guess, I think a majority of our clients just work the executors. It's probably more than half don't ever make the attorney calls. So congratulations on taking that first step. And like you said, you'll learn as you go and you're going to get great at it. It's going to pay off all your longterm. So good job. I appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. So we have no one more, nobody else in the queue. If anybody wants to jump in one last chance. And obviously nobody got Bruce's secret answers. So Bruce, we've got about four minutes left on the call. Go ahead and share the techniques that nobody guessed. All right. I'm shocked that nobody got us. I'm going to give you the basic level technique. And as soon as I say it, there's going to be a bunch of people listening to this call that go, Oh man, I knew that. Okay. But then I'm going to take it a step further and this is not. Specifically probate related. We're just giving you some advice on how to go get deals, get get clients and have more conversations even, and a competitive market like this. And that is through the act of circle prospecting. Now if, obviously you have a listing, a lot of people on this call or circle prospecting around their listings around their open houses. And that's the way that we've all been taught and trained to do that. But for those of you who are agents. And those of you who are investors, I want you to try to take some nuggets from this as well, but it's specifically designed for agents. If you have buyers, which right now it seems like a lot of us don't really want, I want you to circle prospect around the neighborhoods that your buyers are looking in. The, so you don't have to wait until you have a listing. You don't have to wait until you have an open house to call around that neighborhood. You can do it when you have a buyer looking in a certain area as well. One of the things that I used to do in my market and that worked really is what I call using bait to catch bait. And I would go out and I'd find a unique set of criteria that buyers might be interested in. And living in Raleigh, North Carolina, there's two things that we don't have. We're not far enough self to have a lot of in-ground pool. And our soil is a little too Sandy to have basements. So I went out and I ran an ad that said you're a buyer and you want a basement and a swimming pool. I have those listings. And I got buyers to sign up for houses with basements and swimming pools. I didn't have the listings yet. So then I went and I did a reverse search and I found everyone in the County who owned a home with a basement and a swimming pool. And I wrote a letter and I said, I have buyers looking for basements and swimming pools. And every single week I would get at least one person that would chime in with a home that would say Hey, I have a house with a basement and a swimming pool, and I'd be interested in selling. So essentially you're creating inventory out of thin air and you're creating buyer lists out of thin air just by offering something that might be a little bit unique. And when you mix circle prospecting into the mix and you start calling these people. It's really dynamite. I know that's not probate specific, but if you're looking for inventory, go off market and start running a campaign like that. Perfect. Great nuggets to end the call guys. Guys, as we didn't have a winner of the week, so save up your wins for that. Please share your successes with us and you can email us ahead of time if you're not able to make the call. We'll present your win for you. I want to I always do. I think each and every one of you for being here, I want to particularly thank those that actively in. I want to challenge each of you. Take one thing that inspired you on today's call. Go out and put it into practice. Come back next week and share the results with the group. Have a great week, guys. We'll talk to you. Same time. Next Thursday. Take care.